Monday, April 20, 2009

Gun Open Carry

OPEN CARRY 
'Exercising Right' Called 'Unreasonable' by Some
A comment by Jason sparked my interest enough to do some sleuthing ....
Guns Worn In Open Legal, But Alarm Va.
'Exercising Right' Called 'Unreasonable' by Some

By Tom Jackman
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, July 15, 2004; Page A01

On July 2, Fairfax County police received a 911 call from a Champps restaurant in Reston. Six men are seated at a table, the caller said. They're all armed.

Dispatchers quickly sent four officers to the scene. The officers were "extremely polite" and were hoping that some of the men were in law enforcement, said Sgt. Richard Perez, a spokesman for the police department. None was.

The men told the officers "they were just exercising their rights as citizens of the commonwealth," Perez said.

Turns out, packing a pistol in public is perfectly legal in Virginia. And three times in the last month, including at Champps on Sunset Hills Road, residents have been spotted out and about in the county, with guns strapped to their hips, exercising that right.

In the first episode, at a Starbucks, Fairfax police wrongly confiscated weapons from two college students and charged them with a misdemeanor. Police realized their mistake, returned the guns and tore up the charges the next day. Police commanders have since issued a reminder to officers that "open carry" is the law of the land in the Old Dominion.

Forty-four states have a provision in their state constitutions similar to the Second Amendment of the Bill of Rights (the exceptions are California, Iowa, Maryland, Minnesota, New Jersey, and New York)

The following states have no stated restrictions, or specifically allow Open Carry without a permit, some with provisions similar to Arizona.  Corrections will be appreciated.
Concealed carry requires a permit. Open carry is legal without a permit in most places where it is legal for permit holders to carry concealed and law enforcement is well-versed as to its legality. With holsters the gun can be partly covered; if no holster is present the firearm needs to be completely revealed. - AZ


  • AZ,
  • CO (in all but Denver),
  • DE,
  • ID,
  • NC (by omission),
  • NM,
  • PA (except Philadelphia),
  • SD,
  • TX (Long gun only),
  • UT (if no round in chamber),
  • VT,
  • VA,
  • WA,
  • W VA,
  • WI (Excludes bars, Gov't. Bldg, Schools -- Cops will arrest you on something else, because Liberals make law on the fly to suit what seems right.),
Source

25 comments:

Anonymous said...

Awesome, let Chicago be the first to loose their rights. They inflicted their scourge on the rest of the US.

When I was stationed in Yuma, there were lots of bikers walking around with a hogs leg strapped on. Never saw one mugged at an ATM.

Josh Fahrni-Barn Army Dog Catcher said...

I want to buy a handgun, Arizona has one weird law though. I'm old enough to buy a gun from say, my parents or my parents friend. Or just some guy selling one. I can legally buy a handgun. But I can't legally buy a handgun from a licensed dealer. Go figure. I also can own a handgun, but I can't buy the ammo for it.

My only option is a .22, and to say that I'm buying rifle rounds. Pretty rediculous. I've been shooting rifles and handguns since I was 4 years old. I'm about the most careful and safest damn person anyone could ever meet around firearms.

Scott said...

Add Idaho to the list of no-license Open Carry states.

Idaho's gun laws are one reason my wife convinced me to move here... though any excuse to leave the Soviet of Maryland was enough for me.

Rodger the Real King of France said...

Thanks Scott ... I just did add Idaho, it slipped by me. The two that surprise me the most - by not allowing - are Texas and Florida. Also, the first (and only) place I witnessed a guy publicly packing was in Denver, and now I see it's exempted from Colorado's open carry position.

Anonymous said...

Maryland's gun laws and general Commieness was a big reason I moved to PA.

To clarify PA's rules, carry on school property and government buildings is verboten. Courthouses and such must provide a place to store them while inside, meaning you can walk in armed but will need to hand it over while inside. I don't find that unreasonable, but the prohibition on school property is. Faculty, administrators, and custodians (i.e., anybody who has every good reason to be there) should be allowed.

Annoyed White Male

Anonymous said...

P.S.
While open carry is technically legal, that doesn't mean it's a good idea. If you don't have a half-decent reason, don't. You'll make us look bad. It will attract law enforcement attention and label you as a trouble maker. Unless you are making a show intentionally to exercise your legal freedom and "educate" the police on the law, keep it out of sight. It's too easy to get a CCW in most of those states.

AWM

Anonymous said...

Open carry means "shoot me first."
Carry concealed, people. It doesn't scare the citizenry, and it doesn't make the gendarmes wonder what you're up to... and you can go armed even where it's prohibited, if you can keep a secret.
—DougM

Rodger the Real King of France said...

AWM - we're talking "Open Carry WITHOUT A PERMIT" No registration required. That seems to me a most basic principle guaranteed by the Second Amendment.

rockville said...

It should be as simple as "open carry is legal", but there are plenty of exceptions, even in states that allow it.

Some are obvious: courthouses, schools, etc... Some are not. Restaurants, places which serve alcohol, college campuses. These all vary by state. And don't get me started on car carry.

here's a good guide to carry laws.

Anonymous said...

I get it Rog, I was just clarifying existing PA law. Yes, you can open carry in PA without a permit. Yes, if you walk into a bank or mall doing so, you will likely end up with guns pointed at you, and it might not be cops doing it. You can explain the law to the police while you're face down in cuffs if you want. If a cop wants to teach you a lesson he'll throw something like disturbing the peace at you even if he knows it won't stick.

A different situation would be, say, walking you dog in a rural park area. It's far less likely to upset onlookers and a lot easier to justify should they call 911.

PA cops are pretty good about the general issue of weapons and know the law, but might still ruin your day if you're being an ass. You can carry a machete in PA if you have some reason to do so, but a double-edged blade can only be used as a weapon and a 3 inch one can get you in trouble. Can I be in a rural public park with an 8" Gerber BMF on one hip and a Browning HP on the other? Yes. Try that in a Philly 'burb and see what happens. Take the number of a lawyer, too.

AWM

Sven said...

Rockville and all'y'all,

That purty, busty beauty on the Carry Laws site is one of Oleg Volks favorite models...Texan Lori:

http://olegvolk.net/gallery/friendsandstrangers/lori/

He's one helluva lucky cuss!

Anonymous said...

An armed society is a polite society.

Javert

Rodger the Real King of France said...

Lemme say this, given our family's experience, Philadelphia is one city you should never visit without carrying - in your hand.

Pawpaw said...

Louisiana is an open carry state.

David said...

You can open carry in certain parts of Kalifornia, as long as the weapon is unloaded

http://caopencarry.blogspot.com/

Mike said...

This is why I was born, currently live and will die here in the Republic of Texas.

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.46.htmTexas Penal Code, Chapter 46 Section 2. You CAN carry a loaded weapon in your car, as long as it's concealed. But I'm still going to get my CHL, just for shits & grins.

Anonymous said...

New Mexico is also a no license open carry state. http://www.dps.nm.org/lawEnforcement/ccw/ccwFaq.php - Skyhawker Doug

Rodger the Real King of France said...

::
I see nothing in the source listed about LA making the list.

NM slipped by, I think because I wasn't looking for this type of endorsement.

"New Mexico has an "extended domain" law, which means that a person's vehicle is considered an extension of their home. It is therefore legal to carry a loaded firearm without a permit, openly or concealed, anywhere in a vehicle.[151][152] On foot, no permit is required to carry a firearm unless it is both loaded and concealed."

I added NM. Need a law citation for LA.
::

Anonymous said...

IN many states a CCP prevents you from open carry. In Kansas if you have a CCW and you open carry you can be arrested. That was told me straight from the local CCP instructor who is also on the local PD.
Since my current side arm selection does not include anything easily concealed, I'm not going to bother with a CCW.
Some years back I kept a pistol on the seat of my car because of recurring problems with a certain neighbor. One night I was stopped by the local patrol. On first approach, he shown his light directl on my loaded pistol but said nothing. When he returned with the warning ticket, he suddenly noticed it and went banannas.
After a brief but polite verbal exchange, I unloaded the gun and placed it on the dash.
After that he asked me why in blue blazes I was toting a 44 magnum arround. When I named the problem person his next question was if I had a good supply of ammo to ensure the dirt bag was good and dead.
The next day I got a call from the sheriff and was told to have my ass at the next range day for the local police. I gladly attended.
Over the next three years my dirt bag neighbor was arrested five or six times. I was present for four of them. His last trip to county would have gotten him a permanent stay in Coalinga if this were Kaliphoneya.
Weapons tend ot get the law excited. Since most of the time the ones packing heat are thugs, they tend to react as if anyone with a gun is a thug. If you want to carry open, make sure you know the locals. It will make your life and theirs a lot easier.
JeremyR

Anonymous said...

As a resident of Texas, I carry a 38 Special in the console of my truck. Why? Because I can.

LGD said...

I don't think Wisconsin belongs on your list.

Despite the clear wording of the law, those who carry openly are still arrested, and no the cops are definitely ignorant of the law.

In the following case, they chose to arrest the carrier for disorderly conduct-- apparently that consisted of his being correct when he told the cops he was allowed to openly carry.

Now Ok, he was found not guilty. He was still arrested, mugshotted, fingerprinted, jailed, bailed, charged, arraigned and tried.

And then had to wait to get his gun back.

http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/39722082.html

So of course the issue is back in the courts as we again beg government to allow us to exercise our 'rights.'

http://www.jsonline.com/news/wisconsin/43074132.html

chris said...

In NC open carry is legal by omission... the state has no law against it thus it is legal... there are allowances for municipalities to enact their own bans on city property and at least one city has a city wide ban on open carry... but i open carry all the time without incident.

closed said...

You probably want to take WA off that list.

Open carry is legal, but "alarming" someone with a firearm is not.

So, if some leftard calls the police because you alarm them, you get arrested.

Rodger the Real King of France said...

that's prolly isolated - I think there's mention of it in the source listing. Anyway, it's no reason to cede the actual law to pasty faced lawbreakers.

Jason said...

Really appreciate the research, the comments and links. Just a couple more thoughts:
- having had a few years of commissioned service in the Army, I work hard not to make life hard for the first term private, the new TSA screener or the cop working traffic duty. They have a hard enough job sorting out the crazies and enforcing the law without me giving them something else to worry about.
- agree that open carry is rarely a good idea, just trying to figure out the mechanics of keeping guns and ammo in the city. We're not normally at risk, but we're in the prime evacuation corridor for D.C., and I want to make sure that my wife and I have a better than average chance of making it to our WV bunker if we need to E&A
- I am glad a lot of folks carry, and I think we'd be a lot safer if places like DC encouraged concealed carry for people with formal training in the use of deadly force (especially current and former lawmen and military.) However, in fifteen years in my corner of northern Virgina I have not been in a situation where a concealed hand gun would have been useful. Call me boring, but that's just not where I hang out
- had I known the Real King of France was going to be intrigued, I'd have tried to come up with a more clever nom de plume

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